This is fascinating. I don't much of anything about the Bible, or the history of Christianity. Most illuminating to me is your explanation about how the different books were originally intended to reach a specific audience, in reference to a specific issue. That explains quite a lot. Thank you for sharing your expertise!
Oct 14, 2023·edited Oct 14, 2023Liked by Amelia Mavis Christnot
My goodness. Your experience somewhat parallels mine. Your main point to me is that too many "christians" make a point about enforcing rules that aren't mentioned in the bible. Talk about a power trip!
I too was raised in the Catholic Church and come from a family where members had joined religious orders. The lessons of 12 years of Catholic education never promoted hate nor did they say anything about there being a conflict between science and religion. I had some of the best teachers I ever had, teachers who promoted thinking. After all, God created human brains and science, right? But apparently times have changed.
This is the best thing I’ve read in a long time. I was raised Catholic, went to Catholic school from late 50s through mid 60s. I was taught no science, told that to even enter a non-Catholic church was a sin, taught to take every word falling from a priest’s lips as being direct from god, etc etc. I eventually started to think for myself, but still resent that religious “education”. I really appreciate your essay.
Did you really mean you liked Pope JPII? His canonization was a huge mistake and an embarrassment given the child abusers ( The Legionnaires of Christ and its founder) he supported who just happen to be big donors to the Vatican coffers. The only Pope I liked was John XXIII . He didn’t live that long for any scandals to emerge. The first Pope I remember was Pius XII. Yes, I grew up with all Latin . He was fun😬 🤣 I am very clear as to why I left and also why I do not use Christian as an identity. It has been bastardized.
Yes, as an Indigenous child having a Pope not call me a heathen or savage or justify/defend boarding schools and seeming somewhat progressive was appealing.
I'm not talking hindsight or later revelations like you are or even still liking any of the Pope's—they ALL supported or enabled messed up isht.
I'm talking about him appealing to child-young adult me and many, many others, then getting thrown back into the dark ages with the selection of Pope Benedict.
This is all me, too. Raised Catholic and I knew all the basic facts about the Bible’s assembly and intended audience during grade-school CCD, even before going to Jesuit high school. This stuff used to be common knowledge back before we were quite this flooded with bullshit from social media and cable-TV preaching.
I later embraced Islam as an adult, and anything worthwhile I got from being Catholic slotted quite neatly into that framework, as far as ethics and morality went. But these days I’m not at the mosque much either, and it’s for the same reasons. Namely, I find people in religious communities... unhelpful at best, and too often downright toxic.
As I tell people these days: I believe in God and His messengers. My “brothers and sisters in religion”? Not so much.
Yeppers. Cradle Catholic here with 13yrs of parochial education. Now 60 and just can't stomach the hypocrisy of so many alleged Christians and their insistence on bringing their personal interpretation of the Bible into our political discourse. If Jesus was clear about anything, it was separation of church and state..."give to Caesar what is Caesar's"...taxes. And "give to God what is God's"...your life and soul. Your essay is perfectly written and expresses beautifully my own knowledge and opinions of the Bible!!! Thanks
As a fellow ex-Catholic, I gotta say, you hit the nail on the head. There are maybe 10 verses against homosexuality, if you kinda squint at them sideways. Meanwhile, there are 350 verses on the need to help the poor, to the extent that Jesus specifically mentioned it as the reason some people go to Hell.
And yet, American Christians love to focus on the 10 verses that are kinda-sorta about gay people, maybe, if you squint, and ignore the unambiguous multitudes that say that we should help poor people to not be poor anymore.
Many people who profess to be christian know they're nothing of the sort. The hatred of gays and lesbians has nothing to do with christianity and everything to do with income. If these individuals don't shut up, stay in the closet and have children they don't want, who will pay the tithings? Two things I learned while researching the backgrounds of televangelists is that almost all of them went to law school first, bible school second. I once watched a televangelist making noises on television and when the camera angle changed, I saw an another camera manned by a technician. It got me to thinking about how much those cameras cost as they are large, heavy and obviously very expensive ($250k is a cheapie). In addition to considering licensing, purchase of transmitter, transmitter site, antenna, construction costs, electric bills, etc. I finally released they have far deeper financial pockets than their parishioners could even dream about. Where did that money come from and what is the roi on that investment?
Oh, thank you a thousand times over. You have given me the best foundation I have ever come across for dealing with all the many PHOBIAers in a truthful manner that does not belittle whomever I am talking with. For years I have needed exactly what you have said so beautifully. I grew up knowing only the Baltimore Catechism! It still serves me pretty well and indeed expounds on those ten good rules! Thank you again ...and again!
For some reason atheists seem to know more about organized religion fundamentals than most self-proclaimed christians. Oddly enough I tried to conform and become a god-believing christian, so I own a bible and took world religion classes when I was in my teens and early twenties. Yep, god and monsters are in mythologies around the world.
The epitome of Christian hypocrisy is watching these so called MAGA devotees of Trump prominently displaying and exposing a cross hanging from a neckless to project an image, and a very false one, that they are really good people to be believed. The effrontery for this kind of white nationalist bullshit is really sickening, as are all of the followers of right wing extremism!
I confess: I read your essay with something between joy and relief. For what it is worth, I think you are right on. However, I might be a “heretic”. As I have watched the devolution of Christianity in the hands of modern interpretation, I’m pretty sure that your interpretation of what it actually asks for is close to what the universe itself asks for. I’m from an Episcopal background — that in growing up in Texas was only one step above all the Catholics that were going to hell, so here we are 🙀together again. Thank you for your essay. Wasn’t it always about the GoldenRule in the first place?A variation of that statement is found in almost every religious constructs on earth.
I wrote something about how different Christianity has become from what I was taught as a child. As bad as some of the things done in the religion's name for centuries, in the 1970s it felt like it was heading in a good direction. But I don’t think anyone from then would recognize it now, where profit and cruelty seem to be the point.
💯
This is fascinating. I don't much of anything about the Bible, or the history of Christianity. Most illuminating to me is your explanation about how the different books were originally intended to reach a specific audience, in reference to a specific issue. That explains quite a lot. Thank you for sharing your expertise!
Very well said! ♥️
My goodness. Your experience somewhat parallels mine. Your main point to me is that too many "christians" make a point about enforcing rules that aren't mentioned in the bible. Talk about a power trip!
I too was raised in the Catholic Church and come from a family where members had joined religious orders. The lessons of 12 years of Catholic education never promoted hate nor did they say anything about there being a conflict between science and religion. I had some of the best teachers I ever had, teachers who promoted thinking. After all, God created human brains and science, right? But apparently times have changed.
This is the best thing I’ve read in a long time. I was raised Catholic, went to Catholic school from late 50s through mid 60s. I was taught no science, told that to even enter a non-Catholic church was a sin, taught to take every word falling from a priest’s lips as being direct from god, etc etc. I eventually started to think for myself, but still resent that religious “education”. I really appreciate your essay.
Did you really mean you liked Pope JPII? His canonization was a huge mistake and an embarrassment given the child abusers ( The Legionnaires of Christ and its founder) he supported who just happen to be big donors to the Vatican coffers. The only Pope I liked was John XXIII . He didn’t live that long for any scandals to emerge. The first Pope I remember was Pius XII. Yes, I grew up with all Latin . He was fun😬 🤣 I am very clear as to why I left and also why I do not use Christian as an identity. It has been bastardized.
Yes, as an Indigenous child having a Pope not call me a heathen or savage or justify/defend boarding schools and seeming somewhat progressive was appealing.
I'm not talking hindsight or later revelations like you are or even still liking any of the Pope's—they ALL supported or enabled messed up isht.
I'm talking about him appealing to child-young adult me and many, many others, then getting thrown back into the dark ages with the selection of Pope Benedict.
We are in the same place regarding a lifelong-Catholic leaving the Church. I appreciate you being able to express this better than I could.
This is all me, too. Raised Catholic and I knew all the basic facts about the Bible’s assembly and intended audience during grade-school CCD, even before going to Jesuit high school. This stuff used to be common knowledge back before we were quite this flooded with bullshit from social media and cable-TV preaching.
I later embraced Islam as an adult, and anything worthwhile I got from being Catholic slotted quite neatly into that framework, as far as ethics and morality went. But these days I’m not at the mosque much either, and it’s for the same reasons. Namely, I find people in religious communities... unhelpful at best, and too often downright toxic.
As I tell people these days: I believe in God and His messengers. My “brothers and sisters in religion”? Not so much.
Yeppers. Cradle Catholic here with 13yrs of parochial education. Now 60 and just can't stomach the hypocrisy of so many alleged Christians and their insistence on bringing their personal interpretation of the Bible into our political discourse. If Jesus was clear about anything, it was separation of church and state..."give to Caesar what is Caesar's"...taxes. And "give to God what is God's"...your life and soul. Your essay is perfectly written and expresses beautifully my own knowledge and opinions of the Bible!!! Thanks
As a fellow ex-Catholic, I gotta say, you hit the nail on the head. There are maybe 10 verses against homosexuality, if you kinda squint at them sideways. Meanwhile, there are 350 verses on the need to help the poor, to the extent that Jesus specifically mentioned it as the reason some people go to Hell.
And yet, American Christians love to focus on the 10 verses that are kinda-sorta about gay people, maybe, if you squint, and ignore the unambiguous multitudes that say that we should help poor people to not be poor anymore.
Many people who profess to be christian know they're nothing of the sort. The hatred of gays and lesbians has nothing to do with christianity and everything to do with income. If these individuals don't shut up, stay in the closet and have children they don't want, who will pay the tithings? Two things I learned while researching the backgrounds of televangelists is that almost all of them went to law school first, bible school second. I once watched a televangelist making noises on television and when the camera angle changed, I saw an another camera manned by a technician. It got me to thinking about how much those cameras cost as they are large, heavy and obviously very expensive ($250k is a cheapie). In addition to considering licensing, purchase of transmitter, transmitter site, antenna, construction costs, electric bills, etc. I finally released they have far deeper financial pockets than their parishioners could even dream about. Where did that money come from and what is the roi on that investment?
Oh, thank you a thousand times over. You have given me the best foundation I have ever come across for dealing with all the many PHOBIAers in a truthful manner that does not belittle whomever I am talking with. For years I have needed exactly what you have said so beautifully. I grew up knowing only the Baltimore Catechism! It still serves me pretty well and indeed expounds on those ten good rules! Thank you again ...and again!
For some reason atheists seem to know more about organized religion fundamentals than most self-proclaimed christians. Oddly enough I tried to conform and become a god-believing christian, so I own a bible and took world religion classes when I was in my teens and early twenties. Yep, god and monsters are in mythologies around the world.
Great piece. Thank-you.
Your upbringing, interpretation, and growth into agnosticism is so similar to mine that it’s scary! (Except that I come from rural England)
The epitome of Christian hypocrisy is watching these so called MAGA devotees of Trump prominently displaying and exposing a cross hanging from a neckless to project an image, and a very false one, that they are really good people to be believed. The effrontery for this kind of white nationalist bullshit is really sickening, as are all of the followers of right wing extremism!
I confess: I read your essay with something between joy and relief. For what it is worth, I think you are right on. However, I might be a “heretic”. As I have watched the devolution of Christianity in the hands of modern interpretation, I’m pretty sure that your interpretation of what it actually asks for is close to what the universe itself asks for. I’m from an Episcopal background — that in growing up in Texas was only one step above all the Catholics that were going to hell, so here we are 🙀together again. Thank you for your essay. Wasn’t it always about the GoldenRule in the first place?A variation of that statement is found in almost every religious constructs on earth.
I wrote something about how different Christianity has become from what I was taught as a child. As bad as some of the things done in the religion's name for centuries, in the 1970s it felt like it was heading in a good direction. But I don’t think anyone from then would recognize it now, where profit and cruelty seem to be the point.
Itcomes and goes in waves, along with humanity’s sense of justice: sometimes right, sometimes wrong.